Westall UFO landing site, according to The Phenomenon movie (2020, dir. James Fox)
The Westall event can be divided into two parts. These two distinct parts are frequently mixed together - even by researcher Shane Ryan - and doing so is unhelpful in trying to identify what was seen that day.
Based on science teacher Andrew Greenwood's account given to James D McDonald in 1967, as well as the Term 1, 1966 edition of the Clayton Calendar (student newsletter), these two parts become clear. Some students remember things in a slightly different order, so in their minds the event isn't divided into a "before" and "after" something went down in the Grange. Nevertheless, although the two parts may overlap it's likely they were caused by two completely different events:
Based on science teacher Andrew Greenwood's account given to James D McDonald in 1967, as well as the Term 1, 1966 edition of the Clayton Calendar (student newsletter), these two parts become clear. Some students remember things in a slightly different order, so in their minds the event isn't divided into a "before" and "after" something went down in the Grange. Nevertheless, although the two parts may overlap it's likely they were caused by two completely different events:
- Part 1: UFO(s) seen traveling over the school yard before going "behind the pines" to apparently land at the Grange, before shooting up again. This was witnessed by students on the school oval and from the back fence of the school grounds.
- Part 2: A "cat-and-mouse" chase between one UFO and up to five light aircraft, which Andrew Greenwood described in detail at the time, and the aftermath when some students ran to the Grange. (Note: The UFO descending into the Grange may have happened before or during Part 2.)
Excerpt from the Clayton Calendar, Term 1, 1966, which clearly divides the event into two parts - before and after something went down at the Grange. (Term 1 ended May 13th.)
Term 1 for Victoria public schools was Feb 2 - May 13.
On this page, Part 1, I explain how the witness reports match descriptions of a Hibal balloon and parachute during the descent phase of the mission, up until the object(s) disappeared behind the pines. No physics-defying behavior was reported for this object except where testimonies seem to be mixing in Part 2 of the event. The reports of the object "zooming up" from behind the pines are later embellishments.
NOTE: While there is some confusion about which classes some witnesses were in, the consensus is that some Form 1 and 3 girls and Form 3 boys (at least) were doing PE on the school oval when the UFO was first seen, and some Form 2 girls were in Mr Greenwood's science class.
NOTE: While there is some confusion about which classes some witnesses were in, the consensus is that some Form 1 and 3 girls and Form 3 boys (at least) were doing PE on the school oval when the UFO was first seen, and some Form 2 girls were in Mr Greenwood's science class.
Orientating ourselves
This 1966 aerial map has the main locations marked to the best of my knowledge. Paul S (see below) was working in a market garden to the west of the Grange. Some children jumped the school fence and ran through his field to reach the Grange.
1966 aerial map with main locations marked
"I was looking at something I’d never seen before"
The adult witnesses' descriptions of the flying saucers in the sky are surprisingly lacking in details (perhaps the object was never as close as they now remember) but the witnesses are quick to say it wasn't a weather balloon. While it's possible they know what a weather balloon looks like, there's no evidence they (or the vast majority of humans) know what a Hibal balloon looks like. As children in 1966, it's unlikely any of them knew.
So, their insistence that this was something they'd never seen before is accurate.
The witnesses are also vague about the sequence of events during the period before the UFO went behind the pines. What path did it take over the school? Why do some witnesses report more than one? Why do some think it landed on the oval, close to where girls were playing sport, while others are certain it did not? Did it zip around the sky or was this a feature only of the second half of the sighting while planes were "chasing" it? Did it tilt on its side and zoom away before or after it went down in the Grange?
Allowing for misremembered details and embellishments, how does Hibal account for these observations? The odd movements and tilting could be the balloon changing shape as it caught in gusts of wind. The "astronomical speed" that some (not all) reported as the UFO went down behind the pines could have been caused by the payload detaching and ripping the balloon, which made it collapse and plummet. There's a clue in the testimony of a young market gardener...
So, their insistence that this was something they'd never seen before is accurate.
The witnesses are also vague about the sequence of events during the period before the UFO went behind the pines. What path did it take over the school? Why do some witnesses report more than one? Why do some think it landed on the oval, close to where girls were playing sport, while others are certain it did not? Did it zip around the sky or was this a feature only of the second half of the sighting while planes were "chasing" it? Did it tilt on its side and zoom away before or after it went down in the Grange?
Allowing for misremembered details and embellishments, how does Hibal account for these observations? The odd movements and tilting could be the balloon changing shape as it caught in gusts of wind. The "astronomical speed" that some (not all) reported as the UFO went down behind the pines could have been caused by the payload detaching and ripping the balloon, which made it collapse and plummet. There's a clue in the testimony of a young market gardener...
A projection in the sky
A projection in the sky?
Witness Paul S was 16 years old and working in a field adjacent to the Grange. He looked up and thought: "somebody’s got some way of projecting a film of something into the sky". [Westall '66, 2010] (He believes the time was between 11 and 11:30AM, which cannot be correct as he saw the school children running after it, which was up to an hour earlier during recess.)
A few years later he elaborates with a very detailed (for once!) almost surreal description of the silent, whitish-silver, glowing object he observed in a gap between the pine trees in the Grange, 20 feet above the ground (he doesn't say how far away it was):
"...it seemed to tip on its side a bit, and then the color started to become more bluey greeny mauvey, and it was fading, it became translucent. It was a solid object to start with but went from translucent, transparent, you could see through it, and then there it went - like there was just this resonance left like a gas or fumes or something. And that just moved around, and it went into the pine trees. [His hands waft gently to demonstrate.] But the trees didn’t move. It wasn’t a solid object going through there. It was some sort of residue or gas that went into the trees. There was nothing left of it." [VUFOA-TV Victorian UFO Action, 2017]
A translucent Hibal balloon against the sky looks like a white or silver projection. Near the ground it would take on the colors of its environment. As for fading into the trees, here's a crashed Hibal payload with the balloon still attached and "inside" the branches of a tree. It's easy to imagine the balloon (without payload in this case) "fading" out of sight between an "opening" in the pine trees without disturbing them, as Paul describes.
A few years later he elaborates with a very detailed (for once!) almost surreal description of the silent, whitish-silver, glowing object he observed in a gap between the pine trees in the Grange, 20 feet above the ground (he doesn't say how far away it was):
"...it seemed to tip on its side a bit, and then the color started to become more bluey greeny mauvey, and it was fading, it became translucent. It was a solid object to start with but went from translucent, transparent, you could see through it, and then there it went - like there was just this resonance left like a gas or fumes or something. And that just moved around, and it went into the pine trees. [His hands waft gently to demonstrate.] But the trees didn’t move. It wasn’t a solid object going through there. It was some sort of residue or gas that went into the trees. There was nothing left of it." [VUFOA-TV Victorian UFO Action, 2017]
A translucent Hibal balloon against the sky looks like a white or silver projection. Near the ground it would take on the colors of its environment. As for fading into the trees, here's a crashed Hibal payload with the balloon still attached and "inside" the branches of a tree. It's easy to imagine the balloon (without payload in this case) "fading" out of sight between an "opening" in the pine trees without disturbing them, as Paul describes.
Crashed Hibal (1960s), where the parachute and payload failed to detach. Remains of the balloon on the left. Photo from Thorn (2021).
Paul's sighting was unique because of his location - in fact he added: "I’ve always felt uncomfortable because my description is so totally different from what the school kids saw." Thousands of square meters of translucent material gently moving through the trees explains his different observations.
Ballooning all out of proportion...
In mid-2022 I communicated with three witnesses who also "know what they saw" - they think what they saw was a balloon. They have at times described their experience online, but generally receive negative reactions and accusations that they are trying to discredit those who believe they saw flying saucers. These witnesses feel unheard or shouted down, and two told me that filmmakers, researchers, and reporters are uninterested in hearing or promoting their viewpoint. "There is no money in the truth," one of them says.
Also below are the recollections of two skeptical teachers who offer some insight into the differences between the students' and the staff's attitude towards the event.
Also below are the recollections of two skeptical teachers who offer some insight into the differences between the students' and the staff's attitude towards the event.
Rob N
Form 1, Westall High
Rob was sitting outside behind the canteen, having been "kicked out" of Mr Greenwood's science class.
He saw "several large pieces" of what looked like "silver space blankets" or "silver paper" blowing around in the sky.
"Back then even alfoil was not around really, so was weird to see... a bit overwhelming, never seen anything like it, but was definitely floating in wind, not under own power... WAS NOT A BALLOON shape I saw, was sheets of shiny material... Everyone knew it was rubbish blowing around until someone yelled, flying saucer. Then mass hysteria took over."
Rob is still friends with old schoolmates, some of whom disagree with him when he learned about the Hibal hypothesis. "They still keep up their story, but I reckoned it confirmed mine."
Sources: Westall Facebook, Aug 2020, Sep 2020; Jun 2022 private communication
He saw "several large pieces" of what looked like "silver space blankets" or "silver paper" blowing around in the sky.
"Back then even alfoil was not around really, so was weird to see... a bit overwhelming, never seen anything like it, but was definitely floating in wind, not under own power... WAS NOT A BALLOON shape I saw, was sheets of shiny material... Everyone knew it was rubbish blowing around until someone yelled, flying saucer. Then mass hysteria took over."
Rob is still friends with old schoolmates, some of whom disagree with him when he learned about the Hibal hypothesis. "They still keep up their story, but I reckoned it confirmed mine."
Sources: Westall Facebook, Aug 2020, Sep 2020; Jun 2022 private communication
Peter A
Grade 5, Westall Primary
As milk monitor, Peter was outside fetching the milk crate for his class.
"Some kids were pointing at the object coming from the north over the back of the high school... I could see that it was silver and pulsating. A few seconds later I could see that it was just a large deflated balloon... you might say pancaked out with the sides of the balloon coming in and out.
"There wasn't any commotion at the time and I personally only found it of mild interest... All the commotion was when we were let out [5 to 10 minutes later]. I remember leaning over the back fence and asking what's going on. Two kids were next to the dirt road fence, climbing and beckoning me the come to the Grange. I said no... I had no interest in chasing balloons so I never followed the few into the Grange.
"I didn't even associate it with any sort of UFO as I knew what it was... It wasn't brought up in class and I wasn't aware that there was a UFO incident until decades later."
Peter believes the story has been exaggerated: "The flying saucer at Westall was nothing but a deflated weather balloon. Even as a little 9 year old I could tell the difference... Sorry to burst your balloon but this is the way it was."
Source: Westall Facebook, Mar 26, 2021, personal communication Jun 2022
"Some kids were pointing at the object coming from the north over the back of the high school... I could see that it was silver and pulsating. A few seconds later I could see that it was just a large deflated balloon... you might say pancaked out with the sides of the balloon coming in and out.
"There wasn't any commotion at the time and I personally only found it of mild interest... All the commotion was when we were let out [5 to 10 minutes later]. I remember leaning over the back fence and asking what's going on. Two kids were next to the dirt road fence, climbing and beckoning me the come to the Grange. I said no... I had no interest in chasing balloons so I never followed the few into the Grange.
"I didn't even associate it with any sort of UFO as I knew what it was... It wasn't brought up in class and I wasn't aware that there was a UFO incident until decades later."
Peter believes the story has been exaggerated: "The flying saucer at Westall was nothing but a deflated weather balloon. Even as a little 9 year old I could tell the difference... Sorry to burst your balloon but this is the way it was."
Source: Westall Facebook, Mar 26, 2021, personal communication Jun 2022
Jack T
Grade 5, Westall Primary
"We were out playing and saw an object over and above the power lines. It went over the pine trees at the Grange and out of sight. Four of us ran over to where we thought it landed [he believes it had already blown away], I remember seeing grass flattened in a clockwise direction, but no burn marks. The size of say 15 feet across. I have given it a lot of thought over the years and I'm convinced it was a half flat weather balloon."
Source: Personal communication Jul 2022
Source: Personal communication Jul 2022
Hazel Moir
English & Maths teacher, Westall HS, 1966
In correspondence with researcher Paul Dean in 2017, Hazel said she has "always maintained that there was no UFO landing at the school that day" and her account suggests there was not as much commotion on the day as others remember.
"During the class time that afternoon, the students were hyped up, but few actually reported real evidence of seeing anything. It was gossip built on hearsay... Within the school, students discussed their part in the afternoon, but as the media stories grew, there was a kind of ‘repressed memory’ exercise, where some began to remember things they hadn’t mentioned earlier... I think it’s possible there was some type of flying object which went across the area, but it didn’t land."
She, too, found her version was not wanted: "I have had various researchers contact me across the years, but when I claim it probably wasn’t a UFO, my comments tend to be cut."
She offered this interesting perspective: "My belief is that the real story is the success of a migrant community and their desire for a common history and the reactions to the UFO story is part of that. I also attended the opening of the UFO playground (funded by Kingston Council and an excellent playground) where one of my former students asked me to keep quiet about my UFO qualms because she stated, ‘It’s my only chance to be famous and you’re not going to take that away from me.’... The most interesting story is why a school and broader community want to believe it, and the speed at which a story can escalate."
[Source: Dean, 2017]
"During the class time that afternoon, the students were hyped up, but few actually reported real evidence of seeing anything. It was gossip built on hearsay... Within the school, students discussed their part in the afternoon, but as the media stories grew, there was a kind of ‘repressed memory’ exercise, where some began to remember things they hadn’t mentioned earlier... I think it’s possible there was some type of flying object which went across the area, but it didn’t land."
She, too, found her version was not wanted: "I have had various researchers contact me across the years, but when I claim it probably wasn’t a UFO, my comments tend to be cut."
She offered this interesting perspective: "My belief is that the real story is the success of a migrant community and their desire for a common history and the reactions to the UFO story is part of that. I also attended the opening of the UFO playground (funded by Kingston Council and an excellent playground) where one of my former students asked me to keep quiet about my UFO qualms because she stated, ‘It’s my only chance to be famous and you’re not going to take that away from me.’... The most interesting story is why a school and broader community want to believe it, and the speed at which a story can escalate."
[Source: Dean, 2017]
Gerry Shepherd
Woodwork teacher, Westall HS, 1966
[via Shane Ryan] "He has absolutely no recollection of the military visiting the school, of an assembly addressing the flying saucer issue, or of being asked not to talk about the events of that day. That there were students claiming to have seen flying saucers was spoken about in the staff room for a day or two, but it was not taken very seriously.
"He does not remember anyone - Andrew Greenwood included - ever talking about an RAAF or military involvement in the story. He is adamant that if anything as extraordinary as the police or military visiting the school had happened, he would have witnessed it or known about it. He prided himself on being across all of the things that were happening at the school. Certainly his memory of individual's names, after forty years, was quite amazing.
"His basic take on the day is that it was a story that somehow grew and grew - the snowball effect - because of the enthusiastic imaginations of the students. This was a natural thing given the age of the students involved - and the purported subject matter.
"He respects that other people have different memories of the event, and he does not discount out of hand the possibility of flying saucers per se. He simply does not remember this story being an important one at the time - it just was not talked about in the staff room, and he believes it definitely would have been talked about if any of the teachers had seriously believed a flying saucer had landed nearby. He finds it hard to believe that any teacher would not have talked about it - even if ordered not to - if it had actually taken place. He recognised that Andrew Greenwood had said that he was a witness, but couldn't remember Andrew Greenwood talking about it again."
Source: Westall Yahoo, Apr 19, 2006
"He does not remember anyone - Andrew Greenwood included - ever talking about an RAAF or military involvement in the story. He is adamant that if anything as extraordinary as the police or military visiting the school had happened, he would have witnessed it or known about it. He prided himself on being across all of the things that were happening at the school. Certainly his memory of individual's names, after forty years, was quite amazing.
"His basic take on the day is that it was a story that somehow grew and grew - the snowball effect - because of the enthusiastic imaginations of the students. This was a natural thing given the age of the students involved - and the purported subject matter.
"He respects that other people have different memories of the event, and he does not discount out of hand the possibility of flying saucers per se. He simply does not remember this story being an important one at the time - it just was not talked about in the staff room, and he believes it definitely would have been talked about if any of the teachers had seriously believed a flying saucer had landed nearby. He finds it hard to believe that any teacher would not have talked about it - even if ordered not to - if it had actually taken place. He recognised that Andrew Greenwood had said that he was a witness, but couldn't remember Andrew Greenwood talking about it again."
Source: Westall Yahoo, Apr 19, 2006
Hazel mentions another skeptical teacher, Roger Adams, and he had given Shane Ryan "a very similar account to Hazel’s." [Westall Yahoo, Apr 30, 2006]
Shane Ryan reports that an unnamed prefect/house captain was sent to bring back the kids after recess and again after lunch. "He recalled that the kids were asked not to talk about the incident, and that it died down after only a few days." [Westall Yahoo, Sep 18, 2006]
Additional testimony from a primary school witness who saw an object through his north-facing window that sounds like a Hibal balloon (please watch the video at the top of this page):
Jelte H: "It was a white object or objects around the size of a delivery van... a little above the roof line of the high school... It appeared to be floating as if being carried through the air by the breeze. I would the describe it as appearing as a shoal of fish swimming very slowly through the ocean. I remember thinking, what is that and for the life of me, I couldn't make sense of what I was looking at. [Westall Facebook, Apr 16, 2021]
Shane Ryan reports that an unnamed prefect/house captain was sent to bring back the kids after recess and again after lunch. "He recalled that the kids were asked not to talk about the incident, and that it died down after only a few days." [Westall Yahoo, Sep 18, 2006]
Additional testimony from a primary school witness who saw an object through his north-facing window that sounds like a Hibal balloon (please watch the video at the top of this page):
Jelte H: "It was a white object or objects around the size of a delivery van... a little above the roof line of the high school... It appeared to be floating as if being carried through the air by the breeze. I would the describe it as appearing as a shoal of fish swimming very slowly through the ocean. I remember thinking, what is that and for the life of me, I couldn't make sense of what I was looking at. [Westall Facebook, Apr 16, 2021]
A WORD ABOUT THE WEATHER
From the Bureau of Meteorology website, Scoresby was the closest inland weather station to Westall that has data for Wednesday Apr 6, 1966 (it is 10km to the NE). The previous day was 24C and dropped to a low of 14C overnight. Wednesday's maximum was 16C.
Wind direction was SW and the speed was 24 km/h [15mph] which is Beaufort #4, a "moderate breeze": Wind moves small branches. Wind raises dust and loose paper from the ground and drives them along.
From the Bureau of Meteorology website, Scoresby was the closest inland weather station to Westall that has data for Wednesday Apr 6, 1966 (it is 10km to the NE). The previous day was 24C and dropped to a low of 14C overnight. Wednesday's maximum was 16C.
Wind direction was SW and the speed was 24 km/h [15mph] which is Beaufort #4, a "moderate breeze": Wind moves small branches. Wind raises dust and loose paper from the ground and drives them along.
Where did it go?
Why didn't the children find the balloon when they ran down to the Grange?
There is evidence (on the next page) that the payload actually ended up some distance away from the pines. The chase plane would have relayed the landing site to the ground crew - it's possible they were already there to retrieve the balloon. The 1966 aerial map shows plenty of access to the Grange from the south, unseen from the school. (I am discounting the account of a witness who claims to have seen the landed UFO when she arrived at the Grange. Her earlier testimony does not mention this astonishing uncorroborated fact.)
Many witnesses reported at least two UFOs. Assuming they are not confusing Part 1 and Part 2 of the sighting, the balloon and parachute could account for these two objects. At a distance, the red stripes on the parachute may have been indistinct in the sunlight, or perhaps appear as flashing lights.
Some witnesses as adults draw the objects as cartoon flying saucers, but these are probably extracted from popular culture, not memory. We have only two 1966 drawings, and these as well as their adult drawings look rather like deflating balloons (or possibly parachutes).
There is evidence (on the next page) that the payload actually ended up some distance away from the pines. The chase plane would have relayed the landing site to the ground crew - it's possible they were already there to retrieve the balloon. The 1966 aerial map shows plenty of access to the Grange from the south, unseen from the school. (I am discounting the account of a witness who claims to have seen the landed UFO when she arrived at the Grange. Her earlier testimony does not mention this astonishing uncorroborated fact.)
Many witnesses reported at least two UFOs. Assuming they are not confusing Part 1 and Part 2 of the sighting, the balloon and parachute could account for these two objects. At a distance, the red stripes on the parachute may have been indistinct in the sunlight, or perhaps appear as flashing lights.
Some witnesses as adults draw the objects as cartoon flying saucers, but these are probably extracted from popular culture, not memory. We have only two 1966 drawings, and these as well as their adult drawings look rather like deflating balloons (or possibly parachutes).
Did the UFO exhibit physics-defying behavior?
We have only four eyewitness accounts from 1966 describing the UFO. Two, possibly three, describe the UFO before it went behind the pines, and only one describes it ascending.
So, all we have from 1966 is one, perhaps two, eyewitness reports of an object that "rose up" from the Grange in an unremarkable manner.
In later years, Marilyn consistently does not report seeing the UFO zoom up, despite the fact she was watching it carefully enough to notice it bobbed in and out of view:
Since 2006, some witnesses as adults have described in more dramatic terms how the object ascended (while others make no mention of it). However, what's striking is that these accounts end with the UFO zooming up and vanishing - "just left [the planes] like they were standing still." [Jeff H, Westall '66, 2010]. This doesn't match Greenwood's account - he says the UFO played cat-and-mouse with planes for several minutes after apparently rising up from the Grange.
So the only reliable or early accounts of fast motion and disappearance seem to relate to the end of the aerial chase (Part 2 of the event), not the earlier part associated with the Grange.
A plausible explanation for the perception and now the memory of the object shooting up is that the witnesses kept losing sight of the balloon or parachute as it tumbled in the breeze behind the pines, probably drifting ever southward (so that it was gone by the time the group of children reached the Grange). They assumed that when they saw a different object high in the sky moments later (see Part 2), it must mean their UFO had shot upward.
The UFO's dramatic take-off is therefore a later embellishment, possibly inspired by the confusion created when another UFO appeared in the second half of the event (as described by Greenwood, see Part 2).
Following is a case study tracking the changing testimony of one of the witnesses over the years.
- Student Jeff A wrote an article in the Clayton Calendar (a primary school newsletter), Term 1, 1966. At recess he noticed children running to the fence where he saw “a dazzling silvery object" flying across the paddocks, eventually descending behind the pines. He does not describe it zooming up from the Grange: it merely "reappeared and rose to the level of the approaching aircraft." (The remainder of his testimony is in Part 2.)
- Joy T, who was in science class and so missed at least some of Part 1, does not report that the UFO either descended behind the pines or zoomed up later. She describes "2 circular UFOs flying in various directions" that went "faster than some light aircraft in vicinity" and that one UFO "turned edge & disappeared fast". [Joy T., 1966] Given she mentions aircraft and then the UFO vanishing, her descriptions must refer to Part 2 of the event. This makes sense because she was in class during Part 1.
- Marilyn E, who was also in science class at the start of the event, is not reported saying anything about the UFO's behavior. [Dandenong Journal, Apr 21, 1966, p.1]
- Science teacher Andrew Greenwood reportedly "first saw the object when it rose into the air from behind pine trees near the school". [Dandenong Journal, Apr 21, 1966, p.1] These are not his words, or even a paraphrasing of his words, but a description by the reporter. On the next page I argue that some of Greenwood's testimony was not what he saw, but what he'd heard from other witnesses. He sometimes spoke for them in order to provide a complete picture, because he did not personally witness the first half of the event (he was teaching a class). In any case, this reporter does not quote or describe Greenwood seeing the object shoot up from the Grange. It "rose into the air".
So, all we have from 1966 is one, perhaps two, eyewitness reports of an object that "rose up" from the Grange in an unremarkable manner.
In later years, Marilyn consistently does not report seeing the UFO zoom up, despite the fact she was watching it carefully enough to notice it bobbed in and out of view:
- "The UFO appeared to hover and descend below the horizon many times." [Westall Yahoo, Nov 9, 2007]
- "we could see it in the distance sort of going below the horizon and rising up again" [makes slow hand motions] [VUFOA-TV Victorian UFO Action, 2017]
Since 2006, some witnesses as adults have described in more dramatic terms how the object ascended (while others make no mention of it). However, what's striking is that these accounts end with the UFO zooming up and vanishing - "just left [the planes] like they were standing still." [Jeff H, Westall '66, 2010]. This doesn't match Greenwood's account - he says the UFO played cat-and-mouse with planes for several minutes after apparently rising up from the Grange.
So the only reliable or early accounts of fast motion and disappearance seem to relate to the end of the aerial chase (Part 2 of the event), not the earlier part associated with the Grange.
A plausible explanation for the perception and now the memory of the object shooting up is that the witnesses kept losing sight of the balloon or parachute as it tumbled in the breeze behind the pines, probably drifting ever southward (so that it was gone by the time the group of children reached the Grange). They assumed that when they saw a different object high in the sky moments later (see Part 2), it must mean their UFO had shot upward.
The UFO's dramatic take-off is therefore a later embellishment, possibly inspired by the confusion created when another UFO appeared in the second half of the event (as described by Greenwood, see Part 2).
Following is a case study tracking the changing testimony of one of the witnesses over the years.
Case study: Memory plays tricks (Joy T)
"Why do so many people carry other people's memories, stories, perceived facts about the events as if they were almost their own?"
The above quote was written by Joy Clarke (nee Tigue), in 2006 when she told her story for the first time in 40 years, after watching other witnesses come forward on the Westall Yahoo Group over the previous few months. Her words were prescient: in the years that followed, her own story seems to have done exactly that - changed as she incorporated the memories of others into her own.
I'm not questioning her integrity. I'm questioning the reliability of her memories based on the clear evidence they have changed and expanded after she was exposed to other accounts. Nobody is immune to this process and we need to be aware of it in order to understand why the testimonies of various Westall witnesses contradict each other in impossible ways, and why we can be confident that some are wrong (even if they have personal significance to the witness) and can be ignored if we want to figure out what actually happened that day.
I'm not questioning her integrity. I'm questioning the reliability of her memories based on the clear evidence they have changed and expanded after she was exposed to other accounts. Nobody is immune to this process and we need to be aware of it in order to understand why the testimonies of various Westall witnesses contradict each other in impossible ways, and why we can be confident that some are wrong (even if they have personal significance to the witness) and can be ignored if we want to figure out what actually happened that day.
The witness was in science class and rushed outside to see the flying saucers. It seems from her early accounts that she saw Part 2 of the event (cat-and-mouse chase) and that she missed most (or all) of Part 1 of the event.
1966: In her written report to VFSRS she describes two UFOs making a "whirring noise", "flying in various directions... faster than some light aircraft in vicinity" and that one "turned edge & disappeared fast". This is a description of Part 2, the same as Greenwood's. No mention of anything drifting low over the paddocks or going behind trees at the Grange or zooming up again.
2006: She prefaces her first detailed account by saying she "observed and absorbed the events of the day rather than get caught up in the excitement." Like most of us, she thinks she recorded the events exactly as they happened. Memory just doesn't work that way. She describes things in the exact order she remembers seeing them: one plane flying overhead, then one UFO, then two more planes following it. She is talking about objects up in the sky, but then "the saucer took off from the other side of what is now a football oval". Clearly this not the same event as others have described - when the UFO came up from the Grange hundreds of yards away. It's also not clear if she means it took off from the ground but this seems unlikely since she doesn't explain how it lost altitude, a necessary step before taking off: it was up in the sky with 3 planes, and suddenly it's on or near the ground and lifting off? Perhaps by "took off" she actually means "disappeared". Then the scene ends without any description of what happened to the UFO or the planes, and "later" a girl shows her scorch marks at the fence that used to be a (previously unseen) dog. She mentions only one UFO, not the two from her report 40 years earlier. After school, her sister showed her a circle in the grass just over the fence.
She was later interviewed by three people from VFSRS: "Neither my Mum, Sister or myself remember one of the men having an American accent." [Westall Yahoo]
2007: Now there are three saucers, but two are seen only for "a very short time", acting like "escorts", "flying up and down and left to right" but "as soon as the planes appeared" they flew high and disappeared. This contradicts her 2006 account, where the first thing she saw were 3 planes and one UFO, but no mention of these "escort" UFOs that are now present before the planes even appeared. Again she says nothing about one landing in the Grange. [Westall Yahoo]
2017: It's ten years later, and it seems details have been added that blend in others' accounts of the UFO going down in the Grange, resulting in this muddled timeline: "And then my most vivid memory after they disappeared [went down out of sight?] - because they did, yes, and the aircraft came, buzzed them - the big one came up and it just went straight up in the air like whoosh! Turned on the side... and it just went whoosh and the other two just went whoosh and they were gone."
This "most vivid memory" of observing the UFOs going down and zooming away echoes her 1966 memory of one UFO that "turned edge & disappeared fast" (but not from a low altitude). It contradicts Greenwood's testimony - that the cat-and-mouse chase with planes happened after the UFO rose up from the Grange. And she contradicts her own early account where the two "escort" UFOs disappeared before the planes even arrived. Now all three whoosh away together at the conclusion of the event. [VUFOA-TV]
2019: Her new out-of-order account has solidified: the UFOs first hover over power lines (hovering is a new detail for her, but it's what other witnesses saw in Part 1; however she never describes any UFOs descending hundreds of feet in order to get anywhere near the power lines), then the planes arrive for the cat-and-mouse chase (she concedes there may have been only one UFO which gave the appearance of more because they zipped around so fast), then the UFOs descend into the Grange for 5 minutes before whooshing away.
Now one of the people who interviewed her is named - Paul Norman - and he does have an American accent. [McMahon]
2022: Similar to the 2019 version: the UFOs were zooming around in the sky and then the Cessnas arrived to play cat-and-mouse. Then the UFOs went down in the Grange.
She seems to have incorporated Part 1 of the event (which she did not witness) into Part 2, but she added it at the end when it belongs at the start. She didn't see the UFO floating low over the school, only the one in the sky later (probably a different object - see next page) and this may explain why her descriptions of what the UFOs looked like is almost non-existent after 1966 ("flying saucer" is the best we ever get). [3AW]
2023: "After 57 years, some things are very clear and some things some are a little bit vague."
Unlike in 1966, when she said nothing about the flying saucers descending, she repeats the newer account that they "went down into the pine trees" and that this happened after the aerial display with the planes. Several times in this interview she corrects herself from "it" to "they" when referring to the number of UFOs. They were matte gray, the size of two cars, and for the first time she mentions a row of lights or windows around the bottom but isn't sure. Clearly her memories are being corrupted by other accounts (no other witnesses describe windows, but some describe lights). She saw three, but in 1966 she only saw two. She describes the "big one" [or closest one] "took off straight up in the air, turned on the side... and then they just all went ffft! and they're gone." This contradicts Terry's testimony that it turned on its side a few meters above the ground (where it would've been hidden from Joy's view behind trees) and then zipped away. She recalls "a slight humming", but says they were silent while the planes chased them. In 1966 there was a "whirring noise" which must have been while the planes chased them, as that's the only place she reports seeing any UFOs.
She recalls finding a circle of flattened grass with her sister and shows the photo taken by the VFSRS saying it shows a burned circle, but also says the area was slashed and burned later. The photo does not, in fact, show burned grass and nor did VFSRS describe it as such. It shows an irregular patch of flattened grass that the VFSRS determined was probably wind damage. She reiterates that one of the people who interviewed her was American (contradicting her 2006 account). [In Too Deep podcast]
1966: In her written report to VFSRS she describes two UFOs making a "whirring noise", "flying in various directions... faster than some light aircraft in vicinity" and that one "turned edge & disappeared fast". This is a description of Part 2, the same as Greenwood's. No mention of anything drifting low over the paddocks or going behind trees at the Grange or zooming up again.
2006: She prefaces her first detailed account by saying she "observed and absorbed the events of the day rather than get caught up in the excitement." Like most of us, she thinks she recorded the events exactly as they happened. Memory just doesn't work that way. She describes things in the exact order she remembers seeing them: one plane flying overhead, then one UFO, then two more planes following it. She is talking about objects up in the sky, but then "the saucer took off from the other side of what is now a football oval". Clearly this not the same event as others have described - when the UFO came up from the Grange hundreds of yards away. It's also not clear if she means it took off from the ground but this seems unlikely since she doesn't explain how it lost altitude, a necessary step before taking off: it was up in the sky with 3 planes, and suddenly it's on or near the ground and lifting off? Perhaps by "took off" she actually means "disappeared". Then the scene ends without any description of what happened to the UFO or the planes, and "later" a girl shows her scorch marks at the fence that used to be a (previously unseen) dog. She mentions only one UFO, not the two from her report 40 years earlier. After school, her sister showed her a circle in the grass just over the fence.
She was later interviewed by three people from VFSRS: "Neither my Mum, Sister or myself remember one of the men having an American accent." [Westall Yahoo]
2007: Now there are three saucers, but two are seen only for "a very short time", acting like "escorts", "flying up and down and left to right" but "as soon as the planes appeared" they flew high and disappeared. This contradicts her 2006 account, where the first thing she saw were 3 planes and one UFO, but no mention of these "escort" UFOs that are now present before the planes even appeared. Again she says nothing about one landing in the Grange. [Westall Yahoo]
2017: It's ten years later, and it seems details have been added that blend in others' accounts of the UFO going down in the Grange, resulting in this muddled timeline: "And then my most vivid memory after they disappeared [went down out of sight?] - because they did, yes, and the aircraft came, buzzed them - the big one came up and it just went straight up in the air like whoosh! Turned on the side... and it just went whoosh and the other two just went whoosh and they were gone."
This "most vivid memory" of observing the UFOs going down and zooming away echoes her 1966 memory of one UFO that "turned edge & disappeared fast" (but not from a low altitude). It contradicts Greenwood's testimony - that the cat-and-mouse chase with planes happened after the UFO rose up from the Grange. And she contradicts her own early account where the two "escort" UFOs disappeared before the planes even arrived. Now all three whoosh away together at the conclusion of the event. [VUFOA-TV]
2019: Her new out-of-order account has solidified: the UFOs first hover over power lines (hovering is a new detail for her, but it's what other witnesses saw in Part 1; however she never describes any UFOs descending hundreds of feet in order to get anywhere near the power lines), then the planes arrive for the cat-and-mouse chase (she concedes there may have been only one UFO which gave the appearance of more because they zipped around so fast), then the UFOs descend into the Grange for 5 minutes before whooshing away.
Now one of the people who interviewed her is named - Paul Norman - and he does have an American accent. [McMahon]
2022: Similar to the 2019 version: the UFOs were zooming around in the sky and then the Cessnas arrived to play cat-and-mouse. Then the UFOs went down in the Grange.
She seems to have incorporated Part 1 of the event (which she did not witness) into Part 2, but she added it at the end when it belongs at the start. She didn't see the UFO floating low over the school, only the one in the sky later (probably a different object - see next page) and this may explain why her descriptions of what the UFOs looked like is almost non-existent after 1966 ("flying saucer" is the best we ever get). [3AW]
2023: "After 57 years, some things are very clear and some things some are a little bit vague."
Unlike in 1966, when she said nothing about the flying saucers descending, she repeats the newer account that they "went down into the pine trees" and that this happened after the aerial display with the planes. Several times in this interview she corrects herself from "it" to "they" when referring to the number of UFOs. They were matte gray, the size of two cars, and for the first time she mentions a row of lights or windows around the bottom but isn't sure. Clearly her memories are being corrupted by other accounts (no other witnesses describe windows, but some describe lights). She saw three, but in 1966 she only saw two. She describes the "big one" [or closest one] "took off straight up in the air, turned on the side... and then they just all went ffft! and they're gone." This contradicts Terry's testimony that it turned on its side a few meters above the ground (where it would've been hidden from Joy's view behind trees) and then zipped away. She recalls "a slight humming", but says they were silent while the planes chased them. In 1966 there was a "whirring noise" which must have been while the planes chased them, as that's the only place she reports seeing any UFOs.
She recalls finding a circle of flattened grass with her sister and shows the photo taken by the VFSRS saying it shows a burned circle, but also says the area was slashed and burned later. The photo does not, in fact, show burned grass and nor did VFSRS describe it as such. It shows an irregular patch of flattened grass that the VFSRS determined was probably wind damage. She reiterates that one of the people who interviewed her was American (contradicting her 2006 account). [In Too Deep podcast]
Next up: Some plausible options to explain the second part of the sighting, the physics-defying "cat-and-mouse" game that the UFO played with light aircraft before vanishing.
Sources
- 3AW Mornings with Neil Mitchell (2022, May 19). (Joy Clarke called in.)
- Clayton Calendar (Term 1, 1966). Eyewitness account of a flying saucer [Newsletter of former Clayton Primary School]. Retrieved from Project1947, Source 10.
- Dandenong Journal (1966, Apr 21). Flying Saucer Mystery Deepens: Who were 5 pilots? p.1.
- Dean, P. (2017, Nov 5). Westall High School Teacher Reveals Unexpected Information Regarding Famed Melbourne UFO Case. UFOs - Documenting The Evidence.
- Fox, J. (Director). (2020). The Phenomenon [Film]. James Fox Productions, Farah Films. [Westall is covered from 23:45]
- In Too Deep podcast (2023, Aug 9). Eye Witness to the Westall UFO Incident: Joy Clarke | Ep 155.
- Jones, R. (Director). (2010). Westall '66 [Film]. Endangered Pictures.
- Joy T. (1966, Apr 7). Sighting report to Victorian Flying Saucer Research Society. (Courtesy VFSRS)
- McMahon, J. (2019, Sep 25). Joy Clarke - In The Sky - Westall 1966 (Extended Witness Interview) [Video]. YouTube.
- VUFOA-TV Victorian UFO Action (2017, Apr 15). WESTALL The Witnesses Speak Conference Presented By VUFOA (April 2, 2017) [Video]. YouTube.
- Westall Flying Saucer Incident Facebook Group (created 2007, Dec 2). Shane Ryan (admin). [Cited as “Westall Facebook” throughout.]
- Westall High School 1966 UFO Incident Yahoo Group (created 2005, Feb 14). Shane Ryan (admin). (via Keith Basterfield and Internet Archive). [Cited as "Westall Yahoo" throughout.]
(c) Charlie Wiser 2022
